Reserve Drivers

Ah yes a much debated topic & i am afraid i have to dig this one up again. I don't mean this to take anything away from Chaz _B who drove brilliantly at Spain & thoroughly earned his win, but as he was there to 'practice & test his pace 'for his own league race I feel it does raise the issue of should a reserve driver been allowed to finish & claim 25 points?..

You see I think the League DC & CC championships should be affected by ONLY the official League Drivers & teams and therefore at the end of the season the tables would show a true reflection of the League drivers involved.

This was the case at Malaysia & Bahrain where barwell (who was a reserve at Malaysia but now an official AL2 driver) retired 10 laps from the end & Madman (who was 40 sec in the lead at Bahrain) retired a few laps from the end allowing Rosstheicon to win & all AL2 drivers to jump up a place.

Both these drivers knew that because there were only there to 'reserve' it would seem a bit unfair to those League (AL2) drivers if they missed out on points podiums etc & they did not want their results to have a major affect on the tables.

Now i know people will say 'whats the point in reserving if im not allowed to win? .. well the truth is, its because it is unfair on those that are actually in the League, however I do not want to stop anyone from reserving in the future so maybe we just need a little clarification

How about in the future reserve drivers are allowed to race & compete as normal (aim for pole etc), However once/if they complete 90% of the race they MUST safely retire. This would allow reserves sufficient race time to ' practice & test strategy etc'

Also by allowing reserves to complete 90% of a race this would still allow potential Constructor points to be earned by them & allowing the tables to be mainly affected by only the league drivers themselves. i.e ONLY AL2 drivers can score podiums & big points

This is a format that could be used by all Leagues but i am specifically talking about using this in AL2, so I would like as many AL2 Drivers opinions on this as this is OUR League

So Any thoughts fellas?...

I think this sounds very logical.

the only reason suggested chaz to reserve last week was to see how his pace was against AL2 drivers and he won by miles so now he will move to AL1 as reserve to see how he does there. The constructor points will not be taken away from sauber and that goes to any one else who reserve the point they get will be kept.

Finally my team mate talks SOME sense!

I respect this. Give the points to Senna etc, In what position they would of finished (If you want) as I don't think I Interfered with anyone's race. Had I of known, I would of retired. Sorry.

U didn't interfere u were just too bloody quick

Whiteside ur missing the point the issue isn't why did chaz reserve its whether or not reserves should be allowed to score maximum points. I suggest u read the post again.

No need to apologise Chaz u were unaware just think it needs to be clearer as what reserves can & can't do.

well i have been to every fia meeting soo7ps and not once has there been anything said about reserve drivers not getting maximum points.

 If i remember when i let you and barwell reserve at Malaysia Barwell had a DNF but you finished in 6th place i didnt hear anyone complaining about you taking a place they should of had.

 So the way i see it until i get word of admin that the rule has been put into place everything stays the same.

Plus now i know not to let the likes of chaz and madman reserve because they are to quick.

I think Spain was a 1 off Senna was at least on par with my pace last season if not quicker Oh well, good luck AL2 for this season

What S007PS is trying to say whiteside, he's basically saying reserves shouldn't get podiums, hence why I retired at Malaysia. You didn't attend the race so you wouldn't know, but If S007PS and madman had carried on racing in the positions they was in, they would of got podiums but they decided to do an extra pit stop and hold back and just race each other (I know because I was watching them the last 5 laps)

i did not tell anyone who reserved that they couldn't get a podium you all did what you did of your own backs.

 There for you or anyone else should not be complaining about it when someone else who reserves gets a podium it was your own fault you retired and the other guys had an extra pitstop. 

And that is the end of this conversation

well i have been to every fia meeting soo7ps and not once has there been anything said about reserve drivers not getting maximum points.

I know Mr Whiteside THATS WHY I posted this LOL

As for Malaysia i finished 6th in a Car that no one had driven for & for a team that sat on 0 points. Now im in AL2 so it hardly affected anything thats probably why u didnt hear anyone complain about it.

I just wanted to see if people think if reserve drivers should be able to claim podiums or they should be fought out between league drivers?

Yes we did do that off our own backs, it was something called showing respect to the official drivers in that league to let them battle it out for the points.

if you wanted them to battle it out between themselves u should of stayed at the back all the way or not bothered reserving.

I think you have to look at it in this view, if you were winning a race but then a reserve driver comes along, overtakes you and steals the win, you would feel robbed of a deserved 1st place because your the one in the league, not the reserve driver. I like to reserve because its fun racing against the other people, I don't care about winning or getting a podium, I just reserve to enjoy the exciting racing so I therefore retire out of respect for the AL2 LEAGUE drivers?!

Personally i'd like to share my opinion on this topic aswell, I feel reserve drivers are their to stand in for someone who isnt there, obvious. So he does his best to not affect their constructors as much, which Chaz did very effectively getting 25 points. But i see where your coming from obviously, but in all fairness, again Whiteside with all respect, let's say whiteside reserved and got a 6th place, I personally think no harm would've been done. But i can understand it annoys people which are not officially in the league go on and win races, but obviously Chaz is a one-off as hes quite quick.

It does not matter anymore as they have got what they wanted

I think that S007PS's idea works well even for the constructors though, since it penalises the team for the driver being unavailable but still allows some points to be scored. Why wouldn't we at least give it a trial run to see if it works in practice? There's no need to completely remove reserves as it gives a good opportunity to race against drivers from other leagues.

The decision is that people can reserve if i let them but the highest AL2 driver will get the 25pts even if that person comes third

Lol i knew this topic would create some discussion. Some of u understood why i brought it up , some of u didnt..

So to clarify this WAS NOT a complaint/moaning/bitchin about a reserve driver winning & not allowing me too or so & so retired why didnt he? Blah blah blah
No it was (as we are quite early into a long season) just  an opportunity to discuss how can/should Reserves effectively race & participate in AL2?

Ross that is exactly why i ' suggested ' 90% Race completion as Drivers who reach that (Reserve or not) SHOULD receive some credit and it wasnt meant to seem as any form of punishment. Allowing drivers to race 90% hardly means the have to back off for the entire race either.

No one would then have to be banned from Reserving allowing anyone to take part. CC points earned if reserves retire at 90% although maybe low would still be better than none.

This was all a suggestion to make things FAIR for ALL & that in the End, to ensure  Reserves were not taking to many points away (whether its 25 or 1) from those that are actually involved every week in the League.

I hope this clears up the reason why I brought up this Topic &  why there now has been a ' new decision ' allowing AL2 drivers to be promoted over reserve drivers results.

Now that's over we can turn our attention back to the Racing & having Fun ..

I get it yes, I don't wanna be annoying lol but the retire thing is in conflict with the rule if you retire but you have completed 90% u dont get points if u retire urself.

No one will have to retire now that admin came up with the decision to let people reserve but they don't get any points for it

but that way they still take away points from the league drivers they finish ahead of?

No they don't if you finish 3rd and get beat by a reserve driver you will be rewarded 18pts instead of 15pts